the 2 real reasons why Americans are hated..

[Më£ïñÐa]

A long, but quite interesting read...


What most angers people in the mostly-Muslim nations has been two things: US support for Israel and the continued US war against Iraq. Israel is the result of the Zionist movement, an effort to plant European people in the "Third World" land of Palestine. Zionism's aim was to create a Jewish State, a state of "the Jewish people" everywhere in the world, as opposed to the people of whatever religion who actually lived there. It intended to occupy all the land supposedly held by the ancient Hebrews 2000 years ago. Its justification was the Jewish bible - and a promise by the British empire (the "Balfour Declaration"). The main people who were actually living there were not to be consulted of course and could not be, because these goals required dispossessing those Palestinian Arabs.
A Jewish population, fleeing from the after-effects of Hitler's genocide, was channeled into Palestine to replace the original population (who had had nothing to do with European atrocities). Through a series of wars, massacres, and supposedly legal actions, the Palestinian peasants and workers were mostly dispossessed. Their lands, their farms, their orchards, their villages, and their cities were taken away. They are not allowed to return nor granted compensation. A small number still live in Israel as second class citizens, Muslims and Christians in a (by definition) "Jewish state." Half of the others live in the West Bank (of the Jordan River) or on the Gaza Strip, under Israeli occupation. The other half is scattered among the Arab nations and elsewhere.

For some time now, most Palestinians and their organizations have accepted the reality of Israel. They know it will not go away and cannot be militarily defeated. Therefore they have only asked for self-determination on what is left of Palestine, on the West Bank and Jordan. The Israeli state has controlled these areas for 35 years now, the longest military occupation of another land in recent history. While pretending to negotiate (the Oslo "peace process"), actually the Zionists have expanded the number of their settlements in the these Occupied Territories, as well as the size of the settlements. This has been spearheaded by reactionary Jewish fanatics, the mirror image of the Islamic fanatics. But it has had the support of the various Israeli governments, both liberal and conservative. The state has linked the settlements by a network of roads and military garrisons. The Palestinian areas have been carved into unviable islands. Meanwhile, the Israeli state has insisted on the right to own virtually all of Jeruselum, while the Palestinians have only asked for half. Not surprisingly, the so-called peace process died of its own hypocrisy.

Throughout this awful history, the US state has been the major ally of Israel. The Palestinians fight with stones or small arms. Israel fights with US-made helicopters and weapons, as well as its own (it is an open secret that Israel has nuclear bombs). All US politicians assert their undying support for Israel. Billions of dollars have been given to Israel by the US state. This is partly due to the domestic strength of the pro-Israel lobby,
but Israel is useful to US imperialism in controlling the Arab states. In war after war, Israel has beaten the Arab armies. In fury and frustration, many Arab workers and peasants have turned from the secular movements which are willing to recognize Israel. Some look toward fanatical religious parties who are willing, in their military weakness, to use terrorist attacks on Israeli workers. As long as the Israeli government, with US support, does not adapt to living with Palestinians (by withdrawing both troops and settlements from the Occupied Territories, for example), it will continue to enrage Arabs and Muslims against both itself and the US.

The other issue which has particularly angered many Arabs and others has revolved around the US war with Iraq. Like many other dictators, Iraq's Saddam Hussein was supported by the US state when it seemed convenient. For eight years, the Iraqi regime was in a pointless but bloody war with its neighbor Iran. The US rulers were pleased that Iraq was weakening the Iranian regime. The US provided intelligence to the state of Iraq, permitted Hussein to buy hard-to-get weaponry, and helped him in other ways.

But, as bin Laden was later to do, Hussein turned on the US He decided to invade Kuwait, a small but oil-rich country. It had one of those monarchical-feudal regimes, which oppressed the large number of Palestinians and non-Arabs who worked there. Due to the oil, and to the challenge to its authority, the US state made an issue about this particular atrocity.

Suddenly Saddam Hussein was declared a very bad man and a vast military force was assembled to defeat Iraq. And it was defeated, partly because the Iraqi soldiers (workers and peasants) would not fight for their government.

In response to this defeat, Iraqis rose up to overthrow the government, especially Shiite Muslims in the South and Kurds in the north of Iraq. But the US state did not want a revolution. It might destabilize the region, upsetting all those friendly dictatorships. Freedom for Iraqi Kurds might stir up the Kurds under the control of the Turkish allies.
The US rulers hoped to replace Hussein with another military ruler, different from him only in being more cooperative with the US So the US army stopped short of destroying the Iraqi military. It left Hussein enough to reestablish his role. Instead the US military continued to watch over and "protect" the Kurds and southern Muslims by flying US planes over a large part of Iraqi airspace. Many people do not realize it, but ten years after the Iraqi war, the US is still flying planes over Iraq and still bombing it.

The other method the US used, to pressure Hussein, was an embargo. The Iraqi rulers can only sell a controlled amount of its oil, and buy only a limited amount of food and medicine and other goods. This is supposed to either make Hussein behave or to inspire the military to replace him. As an effective dictator, Hussein has kept his officers under control. Meanwhile, he really does not care that his people starve or lack medicine, so this does not pressure him.
At least a half million children have died from this embargo policy. That is many more people than died in the recent attacks on the US The US rulers are continuing to wage a war on the Iraqi peasants and workers. This is widely known in Europe and in the mostly-Muslim nations, but the US working class has been kept in the dark.

So, there are good reasons for many people to hate the US, in the Muslim nations and elsewhere. Even those who are favorable to the US are usually ambivalent, liking something and hating others. Perhaps some of the hatred is irrational, due to the way the US imperialism has broken up traditional societies but replaced them only with poverty, chaos, and dictatorship. The program of many oppressed people has sometimes gone into the dead ends of terrorism and religious dictatorship. But they have legitimate grievances. Their working people have suffered far more than working class people in the US have any idea. "Americans" should not be surprised if the evil their ruling class has done abroad should be returned to them.

<FONT COLOR=#C4C4FF>*i believe this dude, doesnt deserve to live here....</FONT>

--------------------------------------------
Written by Wayne Price, a long-time revolutionary anarchist and libertarian socialist who lives in New York City, near the heart of the storm...

<FONT COLOR=#C4C4FF>*wonders how many Governments he's lived under, or how many countries this Dudes lived in, with nuts like Loddin in control..

*my comment is...
i dont have a comment..
yes i do! i disagree when the author said its our (Governments)struggle for total control and power..
We are not Demonic in nature..
and our presents in someplaces deters those that wish to control in an inhuman way...
we are not trying to take over anything...
force people out, to rule with our own race... ect..ect
If all, was in peace over there, instead of trying to be taken over, back and forth by complete inhuman, unethical, Rulers...
There would be no need for the presents of anyone......
i think its very wrong, the way they see us...
i believe they see us as taking over and controlling.... but we're not forcing, ideals that are unethical, or RULING in the name of America.....
if we Mac Donaldize ya!! it just means, 'we love to see you smile' its not forcing anything down your throat...

I dont quite understand the Palestinians and the Jewish Muslim part...
i dont know where i've been...but i've always thought the Jewish were victims, i've never known anything different... till now!!?
From what i've just read.... i dont agree with any part of it...
unless, of course i'm misunderstanding the whole thing...
*shrugs
No! Doubt! the 'way' our Government does things is probly wrong....
But how counterdicting is this..?</FONT>

As an effective dictator, Hussein has kept his officers under control. Meanwhile, he really does not care that his people starve or lack medicine, so this does not pressure him.
At least a half million children have died from this embargo policy.

<FONT COLOR=#C4C4FF>Hello?!! knock knock!!... from this embargo policy?????? huh?? Or because AssWipe
Hussein, is an effective dick-tator and can keep his officers under control, by letting them run free with rape and torture n not give a shit about anything else..??</FONT>

US imperialism has broken up traditional societies but replaced them only with poverty, chaos, and dictatorship.
<FONT COLOR=#C4C4FF>Societies, like Hitlers!? with the dictatorship of democracy and freedom to choose....????

oh! and what i think about theee aauh! 'supervision' of thee aauh! oil wells!??....
we need it too, they dont need to hog it all!! we're just makin sure we get some!!...
oh!shit!.....

*Thanks Rant for posting the address</FONT>...Against War and Terrorism

[Xenia]

.......mel...that was interesting thanks for the read......
im not going to sit here and preach about why america is so grand and righteous because america is not ..and neither is any other nation or government body...i will say my peace tho........no country helps other countries more than america...whether for selfless reasons or for self serving purposes..this is true........some of the embargos and sanctions we have may be too tough but they sit and blame the US for all the hardships of the ppl in the middle east, its bullshit.........do you see the way the those leaders live...like fucking kings.....billions and billions of dollars...gold....oil.....drugs.and the money from drugs and what do they do..they keep it all for themselves and blame america for bringing poverty upon the ppl.......instead of funding terorrists take care of your ppl,
instead of opressing.they punish ppl for wanting to better themselves,for wanting to learn...why???are they afraid ppl will see them for the conveluted fucks they are...
*grrrr...there are so many facets to the story..its frustraing to try and comment on everthing........

------------------
A life of reaction is a life of slavery,intellectually and spiritually.
One must fight for a life of action,not reaction.

[Paige420]

you wanna know anoter reason? *smiles sweetly*

YA'LL FUCKIN SHUT DOWN OUR SAWMILLS!!!

fuckin.. more money my ass

this shit with the soft lumber trades is PISSIN ME OFF!!

my dad used to run the 2nd biggest sawmill in town.. now it;'s nothing..

our crew consists of a whole.. 2 people.

my mom is on unemployment..

my dad is FINALLY getting the mill back on it's feet.. after THREE LONG MONTHS..

i now know what it's like to go to bed hungry..
and to be able to hear my mom say she has no money for me to be able to pay my student fees at schoool

*sighs*

i mean... yeah that shit you were talkin bout mel.. that's really bad.. shit.. i'ma shut up now.. sorry guys.. i'm really depressed today... *sighs*

------------------
2 Strange 2 Live ~ 2 Rare 2 Die

[Xenia]

paige sorry about your fathers buisness.
the story behind that if other ppl dont know is that Bush let the sanction just desolve itself because the american lumber suppliers were complaining that they too were going broke because the united states was able to get lumber from canada for cheaper and in turn the american companies lost major revenue.I think it was part of Bush's campaigne promise.I know what your family went through my girlfriends uncle lost alot of money here in the states.Just goes to show you that you cant make everybody happy all of the time.Hope your family recovers paige.


oh just another thing while on the subject.
Fuck em in the middle east because we get more oil from canada now than we do from the middle east.Canada also sold us alot of energy while america was in major need.
america is a nation of mass consumers.our ppl have money to burn and spend.alot of it too.
thats what pisses ppl off too,because we have the means to consume whatever we want.and because we can and do,our consumption brings money to other countries.its a give and take thing.all parties benefit.but america will always look like the asshole.


------------------
A life of reaction is a life of slavery,intellectually and spiritually.
One must fight for a life of action,not reaction.

[~BadRodeo]

<IMG SRC=http://www.adoptasoldier.com/images/WarPaint1.jpg>


------------------

[CrazySam]

Mel, Did you write the comments in white up there? Miss you by the way!

------------------

[phantas~]

Now...I dont hate americans....whether those of the united states or those of the other parts...in fact I rather like them in general and some in particular and I dont mind if they speak spanish or rant on in strange warbling sounds like a vinyl record playing backwards..(those are more difficult to understand 'cept for those like me who played sergeant pepper endlessly and worked everything on the cover out *W*)
BUT.....the US foreign policy has stunk frequently during and after the cold war (no that doesnt excuse the attack on the towers at all...far from it)
and....well...american cultural domination really pisses many people off....from those who arent christian and hate to hear god bless america (didnt bob dylan parody that 0 years ago?...whose side is god on?....really!!!!!!!!!!!) to those like me that hate what Disney did with alice and pooh. That is not any reason for terrorism...but it is a word of caution about how america should behave in this world which it does not own....in fact spends a fifth of all the world spending (as if that were a way to judge anything)
...so.....
behave....listen....learn...and .....help end terrorism including by huge multinational companies and ideaologies including your own...(money /consumerism is not the only way to establish/maintain democracy as well exemplified by many other countries' economies) and you dont have an exclusive right to the trademark. But....lets all agree to start with bin laden.....who so obviously deserves it.
and.....bad rodeo...thanks for helping my good friend M when she really needed it

------------------

[~BadRodeo]

~S~

------------------